Save Version overwrites itself, why didn't they tell me?

[Just LisaParticipant]

Using Studio One 4.1 currently.
Overall, I'm very happy with it.

But, I finally figured out that it doesn't SAVE the way I thought it did.
So, all of the files I thought I saved at various points in the mixing process aren't what I thought they were because every time I hit "control S" , it was saving to that same version.

Turns out, I don't have any way to get back to some of the mixes even though I thought I was planning for it.

Anybody else have that problem? Any creative workflow ideas?
: )

[Terry StambaughParticipant]

Hi Just Lisa,

I don't use Studio One so I can't speak from experience, but I did run across this video that clarifies the Save Version vs Save As. The creator recommends using 'Save as' for most purposes.

https://support.presonus.com/hc/en-us/articles/115005943506-Episode-78-Save-As-vs-Versions-in-Studio-One

In Reaper you can set up a template for auto-incrementing file names, and it will also do auto backups using different version numbers at specified time intervals while you are working - maybe Studio One has the same functionality?

Hope it helps!
Terry

[Jay PetersParticipant]

Hey Lisa,

Just noticed your message, i'm currently upgrading to 4.1 as I write.
As Terry Says, i tend to use 'Save As' at each stage and create a milestone i can go back to, so for example my saved files may look like this;

newsong_Editing
newsong_quickmix
newsong_Mix v1
newsong_Mix vocal tweaks
newsong_final-automation
newsong_Print

However the autosave function is here;

Options/Locations/User Data

I've never bothered with it, so probably check out the Presonus forums for more information.

All the best
Jay

[Just LisaParticipant]

Milestones, that's what I thought I was doing!
So for example, I create
1.0 Rough Mix
1.1 Drums finished
1.2 vox fx
1.3 starting automation

Let's say I mixed it down. Decided I don't like it and want to go back to an older version. The 'snapshot' I thought I created: e.g. 1.2 vox fx isn't the version I first saved, but the version created when I hit control S right before I saved 1.3. That is: all the changes between saving 1.2 initially and creating 1.3. So there's no way to get back to the milestone of 1.2.

I guess I'm thinking I need to get into the habit of saving the milestone version. And then immediately create the next version and work into that one.

It's frustrating because it took me so long to realize that I don't have the save points I thought I was being so careful to create all this time.

Save As, may be the better way to go. That way I can be pretty sure that the end point of the previous version is the place I want to go back to when necessary. But then, I need to Save As again before I start editing that file! Yikes.
: )

[casey dankleParticipant]

Hi Lisa,
I assume you know that you CAN get back the songfiles that you saved evem though they do not have the filename that you thought you were giving them. You will have to have some idea of when you saved, for example 1.0 rough mix, and then go into history and look at the songfiles that were created on that date and time. The files are there somewhere in your history. Tedious, I know. When you find what you are looking for in history, rename it. But as others have mentioned, use the 'save as' going forward.

[Simon BrownParticipant]

I suppose the way to look at it is not that you're creating snapshots, but that you're creating a new version which you'll then work on.

"I need a new version of this mix", save new version, work on the new version.

It does also imply that if you really do want a snapshot of how things were when you initially created the new version, loading the version before should do it? I suppose it maybe depends on how often you save. I haven't dug into the feature much, partly because of the lack of any clear explanation of how it works. 🙂

[Just LisaParticipant]

"Lack of clear explanation" pretty much describes the whole Studio One User's Manual. I'm tempted to offer to write the index myself -- for free.

"Snapshots" would be a fantastic feature, I think. The term helps define my need very well.

I've been thinking about how to use "Save As" and "Version" more intelligently. Maybe most importantly, to save a version with a very descriptive title "this is the version I used to make MIX 3 that I put up for Feedback Friday" immediately after uploading to Soundcloud! And then "save as" a new file before I start messing with it again.
Today, I went back to that "MIX 3 version" and saved it as 'the changes I'm making after Feedback Friday'
The titles aren't quite that long, of course.
I just have to remember to think more carefully about what I'm doing.
: )

[face (chris) JantonParticipant]

I am very novice with Studio One, but I do use it. Primary DAW is Logic Pro X. In Logic Pro X there is a concept of an "alternative". The steps go like this -

1. Make "New Alternative" which gets a name that you can use for the new one...
2. Rename the previous alternative if you so desire.

At this point I can select an alternative and have everything setup as it was at the 'stopping point' of the work...

I use it a lot with set-long recordings of a band. I chop the set up with an audio region for each track for each song, so a bass track will have a separate audio region for each song. Adjust, mix, EQ, whatever for each song. When song is done create a new alternative (for the next track) and "save". Now I rename the previous alternative as necessary, usually the name of the song.

When all is said and done I can open the project and choose the alternative/song to get to the state where I produced a rough mix. This is very helpful now, two years after I started doing this, since I want to go back to my original tapes and make new mixes. I can jump in to the project, listen to what I had accomplished, and these days simply export the audio regions for a new "song" project that is independent of the master tape.

Lots of noise here...my fault...I'm trying to explain/examine my workflow of "versioning". What I want to be able to do is work on a song, save the song at multiple stopping points and/or transition points, and be able to step to any point in the timeline and "start over". Preferably without saving 200-300 MB of audio files each time.

To get to the clearer answer...when I mix a song and send to Soundcloud I always make a new alternative right after I submit. I change the name of the alternative (whatever it was) to "Submitted to SoundCloud - YYYYMMDD"

I am a serial tool abuser. Have been for 45 years. I will wander through the Studio One world and see if I can make sense of how I would accomplish the same thing as Logic Pro X in the Studio One realm. Always good to know?

NB - Logic Pro X Alternatives are very much like what I perceive to be a snapshot.

[face (chris) JantonParticipant]

Forgot to add this link - https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/safe-keeping - that suggests ways to preserve work in Studio One.
It's 4 years old, but probably still mighty relevant...

[face (chris) JantonParticipant]

Hmmm. I have tried working with Studio One 4 on multiple versions of a song. Imported my latest test band track. Moved some things around. Saved. Created a new version.

Quit Studio One, opened Studio One, got my latest version. Made some changes (added a T-Racks processor on output) and saved.
Quit Studio One.

Opened Studio One. See the latest version. Did a "Restore version". Got something that looked like the original. No plugins, etc.
Made changes. Added iZotope "Nectar 3" (love it! really!). Quit Studio One.

OK - back to Studio One - ooooh - it decidedly does not do good things! I get very strange behaviors when switching between versions. Bad Studio One, no biscuit.

At this point it appears that the "proper" behavior comes from a "Save As..." which saves a new song file. With appropriately named song files one should be able to get to the proper starting point for a session.

I have no idea what happens if I edit audio (usually I only mess with the regions in Logic Pro X which doesn't change the base audio file) but hopefully there is a clear path here...

Do some work on a song. Save the song - assume "Song A"
Do a "Save As..." and give the "new" song a name like "2018-11-08 submitted to SoundCloud".

Now you can choose to work on the song in the version "Song A" or the version "2018-11-08 submitted to SoundCloud".

Sigh. So many details. So little time.

oh, yeah, today I ordered 2 new 4TB disk drives at $80 each. Time to consolidate the archives 😉 Black Friday causes so much work.
Just updated my iZotope software to Nectar 3, Insight 2, and friends. Paused my Slate plugins that I haven't really used in 12 months...
Along with the T-Racks goodness of the last month or so I have all the tools I need to keep myself in trouble.

Let's chat!

[Simon BrownParticipant]

Chris, could you elaborate on the "very strange behaviour"? It'd be helpful when other people are trying to compare their experiences to yours.

For what it's worth, I found that (in very brief testing) switching between saved "versions" does more or less what I'd expect; I did the same kind of thing, added Kotelnikov on the mix bus in one version and saved, then switched and added L1 Ultramaximizer on the mix bus on that version and saved. Now when I switch from one version to the other, the appropriate plugin set is loaded. It seems like it's similar to making a branch in a version control system, but I appreciate that not many of us here are also software developers. 🙂

[face (chris) JantonParticipant]

Very strange behavior means "not like I expected with Logic Pro X".

I think it all behaves in a "rational" way, but that doesn't mean the way I expected.

Simply put - Save As - when making a new song - gives you a decent starting point.

I don't know what to expect. Trying to gauge behavior with expectation.

I think it works just fine, as long as I understand what is being saved and where can I expect to find myself when I recall saved versions of things.

Not trying to make it complicated

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