• This topic has 140 replies, 26 voices, and was last updated 3 years ago by Ross Johnson.
Viewing 12 posts - 73 through 84 (of 141 total)
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  • #77273
    Chris Knowles
    Participant

      Hey Todd,

      Thanks, I actually used that sight earlier - my scores were all in the -2.x range except Apple because their Integrated LUFS target is -2db below everyone else :D. I appreciate the insight.  Loudness from a mix perspective is something I have had to go back to basics on because I had developed a lot of really bad habits over the years not having any formal recording mixing training (no PLAP 20 years ago).  So, I went back to ground on this one and will check it when I master this latest mix .

      I'll respond to your feedback from that message and thanks again!

      #77274
      Chris Knowles
      Participant

        Hey Patrick, yes, I had put some Sat on the guitar solo because I thought it sounded too thin.  Once I started peeling back the layers, I realized it was way too much LOL.  Thanks for the feedback and I still haven't decided on TR5 or Lurssen. @Todd provided some great feedback on that and I need to muck about with it to see where I get with my (truly) final mix which I'll post shortly.

        #77275
        Chris Knowles
        Participant

          Hey Krishna, Fair enough, I can't argue with that sentiment at all!  Good luck!!

          #77276
          Chris Knowles
          Participant

            Hey Todd,

            (pasting in here so I don't lose context trying to go back and forth - things got crowded in here all the sudden LOL)

            First, thank you so much for the detailed feedback - this is exactly the reason I joined PLAPA and the interactions on this Forum topics are exactly the type of ones I was hoping to have and exchange learnings with folks so you and all the others have reinforced my faith in that decision!

            You said: I'd be very interested to see how the two versions compare in Loudness penalty.  Generally, I like Lurssen better, but I feel like the mixes ended up coming out different.  I feel like the Lurssen version is better balanced, but has a bit too much presence.  There's a lot of sizzle that seems to me would throttle how loud someone is going to turn up the overall level.  The TR5 seems to be lacking in both balance and low end for me.

            My Reply: Yeah, it's that Lurssen magic that does that balance trick really well. The presence and sizzle were all me I think. Hopefully addressed in the latest mix which I'll post shortly.

            You Said: Because the mastering seems to have altered the mixes to me, I'd suggest thinking about how much color you would want/expect from a mastering engineer.  But also valuable to know how much they CAN do!

            My reply: Good point, I was just reading Mike Senior and he said the same thing.

            So the rest of my mix notes are specific to the Lurssen version.

            - I feel like there's generally a really great balance of the musical elements. >> Thank you, that was what I was going for.

            - I personally believe the low vocal is a bit too audible. The performance is not synced well enough to the main vocal to be left audible (in my opinion) >> I would agree, I was shooting for a more aggressive approach there and even after vocal syncing, I decided to push it down a bit more to a subtextual level. We'll see how it comes out in my final mix.

            - I might consider thinking about your use of EQ and how those decisions move different instruments closer and further back. I do think there's a bit too much of the fizzy frequency (4k to 5k), particularly in the guitars.  For example, although the guitar solo isn't really much different in volume from the main vocal, it is so present in those frequencies, it made me reach for the master volume to turn the track down.  It also makes the guitars feel spatially closer to the listener than the singer. >> This was some outstanding feedback - I did play with this some but I am not sure I have completely achieved as much separation as would probably make sense so I will add this to my "learn to do better" list!

            Generally though, really good job!  Best of luck!  >> Thanks again and same to you!!

            #77290
            Felix Rößger
            Participant

              Hi Guys/Girls, Quick question: am I the only one that thinks the Vocal tracks are far too hard deessed on the print?  i mean..the harmonictrack f.ex. . I mean it's one thing to have harsh vocals and deessing them to your liking and having to struggle a bit with it....but "reinventing" sibilance is an friggin annoying task. I mix on Beyerdynamic DT1990Pro which are meant to have exaggerated highs in the 7k area...and even with those....nothing...i think i got smth  but after hearing only darkneeeeffff   slwwweeeepnefff...im not quite sure anymore^^ things I used:  Upward dynamic EQ on hand cut sibilance areas..overall notch eq's..upward compression with Fab-MB...Highshelfes from 4kish with small cuts in 6k-ish and where needed...slates Revival did a bit of work too. much work considering i usually need just a deesser-EQ-deesser chain next to classic EQHighboost-compressor-EQHighAtten. RawMix with Quickmastersettings: https://www.dropbox.com/s/vkz3qql178964zi/Campaign%20Like%20A%20Clockwork%20-%20Patiently%20mp3.mp3?dl=0

               

              #77309
              Magnus Emilsson
              Participant

                Hey Felix.

                Yes, this has been a recurring topic on this song, I don't know if it is too hard deessed, but it is plentifully deessed. For me it didn't present a sonic problem but I didn't need to add any deessing. I'm mainly using a pultec style eq boosting at 12k to keep the esses sounding like 'S' instead of 'F'.

                /Magnus

                #77327
                Chris Knowles
                Participant

                  Hey All,

                  Well, it's as done as it's gonna get 🙂

                  Thanks to all for the feedback - I think it made it a better mix overall.

                  Let me know what you think please but I am all in.

                  https://soundcloud.com/chris-knowles-323595620/plap-mix-contest-june-2020-clc-patiently-chris-knowles-mix

                  Thanks again and good luck to All!

                  #77329
                  Chris Knowles
                  Participant

                    Hey @Todd, thought I'd share 🙂

                    Loudness Penalty Run on Patiently Mix

                    #77355
                    Serge
                    Participant

                      Hi Christopher,

                      I listened to your new mix, you can see that a lot of work has been done, but it feels like too much, hat sounds like a low-quality sample, the solo part is too low, the vocals have lost a useful component, and the mix itself has become "flat" and "lifeless". There is a feeling that there is too much equalization. I passed through the same pass, most likely it happens due to excessive immersion in the process of this mix and at some stage there comes a fatal mistake, but the mix of "not all processed" and "tired" the head does not hear and does not understand that something is going wrong, but there is still the excitement and time limit (deadline) and I want this work to make a breakthrough, but...

                      Soberly looking at the resulting, similar, results, I bitterly admitted the assumptions and reset all work to zero, starting absolutely everything from the beginning, the bare tracks, primary mixing, panning, volume levels... and I didn't try to repeat the steps I had already taken, I just did everything from scratch. I listened to reference recordings, compared how something sounds there and how it sounds in my mix, listened to the instrument or vocals in my mix not solo, but in context, in the whole mix. Worked with breaks etc and surprisingly the mix was the line up should be.

                      I hope not offended, I did not have and do not have such a thought and task.

                      We make ourselves better.

                      #77366
                      Chris Knowles
                      Participant

                        Hi Serge,

                        As I mentioned in my message, I was going for a much more subdued mix and was attempting to target my loudness by EQ'ing the peaks down.  I realized I risked taking some of the liveliness out of the mix but for me, I feel like I made significant progress.

                        I was never happy with the sound of the drum samples Henning used in the stems but decided to go forward with them.  Additionally, the level of the cymbals in all of the "room" stems (OH, Room, Ambient) were not very well balanced and that is why I initially had very little of them in my original mixes.  I did go back and bring them in but never really liked they way they sounded. As for the hats, yes, they were shrill and the EQ I used made them sound more like a tambourine at times but after everything else I was working on, that was one I decided to just leave on the table.

                        I appreciate your offer but as I said, I'm good with where I landed on this mix given where I've been in previous contests. This one has been more of a learning process for me than previous contests and I'm okay.

                        Thanks for all of your feedback!

                        #77372
                        Serge
                        Participant

                          Hi Christopher, the screen shows my high-hat equalization, the high-hat mix has a level of -17 dB, and I also gave compression and reverb to it. I added reverb because I didn't like the result, and adding a hi-hat reverb was the way I wanted it.

                          I try to minimally use equalizers, only in forced measures, so for example I applied equalization on the drums, a little where to lift and where to cut, guitars and bass are mostly naked, without any treatments, only where I added an artistic component, a little delay and compression. On two tracks of guitar for artistic processing, pseudo 3D wanted to do, here is there automated work EQ gave, but did not process more. There are no equalizers on all the main vocal tracks. There is an equalization only on those three tracks that I added myself, i.e. it is purely my personal artistic component, a low growl and the final repetition (delay)of the last word, as in the growl, only for the delay to go deeper.

                          The entire volume level is adjusted by the faders of each track.

                          Yes, I almost forgot, I adjust the mix balance when I include the entire mix in mono.

                          Serge

                          #77375
                          Serge
                          Participant

                            Hi Patrick,

                            I listened to your mix, I liked it, it's still mastering and it should be great.

                            Serge

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